tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3323167987164959411.post2306860706692506523..comments2024-02-11T08:44:50.489+00:00Comments on Peter A Bell: Let's be clear!Peter A Bellhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/14204261467942498747noreply@blogger.comBlogger25125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3323167987164959411.post-62163976817708735672012-10-27T18:50:00.327+01:002012-10-27T18:50:00.327+01:00A weapon you wield very effectively.A weapon you wield very effectively.Peter A Bellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14204261467942498747noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3323167987164959411.post-7700711996412523062012-10-27T18:48:11.495+01:002012-10-27T18:48:11.495+01:00The "nod" was for statements on the matt...The "nod" was for statements on the matter of Scotland's EU status from various authorities which not actually sought by the Scottish government. What Nicola Sturgeon was referring to is the fact that the government's lawyers have now been instructed to look specifically at the whole issue. This will be the legal advice which informs the prospectus for n independent Scotland that the administration will publish next year.Peter A Bellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14204261467942498747noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3323167987164959411.post-29259535429088705812012-10-27T18:47:11.679+01:002012-10-27T18:47:11.679+01:00This comment has been removed by the author.Peter A Bellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14204261467942498747noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3323167987164959411.post-74218081065982066042012-10-27T18:45:14.909+01:002012-10-27T18:45:14.909+01:00The verbal exchange as whole clearly indicates tha...The verbal exchange as whole clearly indicates that Salmond was referring to already published documents. Only the most prejudiced minds can maintain differently in the face of the evidence.<br /><br />The suggestion that a politician of Salmond's unquestioned ability would tell such a stupid lie stretches credulity beyond breaking point. Unless, of course, you are so blinded by prejudice as to have lost the use of your critical faculties.<br /><br />Further evidence of this loss of critical faculties is the fact that you are quite unable to see the glaringly obvious fact that Salmond could not have lied without also breaching the ministerial code.<br /><br />If you insist that he lied then you are also asking us to believe -<br /><br />(a) That, despite all evidence to the contrary, Salmond so is incredibly stupid as to tell a flimsy, pointless untruth on TV.<br />(b) That, despite months of adhering strictly to the ministerial code, Salmond casually breached it in the course of an interview with an arch-unionist like Andrew Neil.<br />(c) That, Salmond having thus breached the ministerial code, Andrew Neil didn't even notice the gaffe. And neither did anybody else for more than six months.<br /><br />I would have thought nobody was credulous enough to swallow so much far-fetched fiction. Seems I was wrong.<br /><br />Announcing that legal advice was now being sought was an integral part of the statement on the consultation. It had to be included because the statement was not only about the consultation but also the process of drafting the prospectus for independence. And legal advice on various issue will necessarily be a significant part of that process. It would have been strange indeed if Nicola Sturgeon had failed to mention the request for legal advice in that context.<br /><br />Many thanks for providing us with a working example of the shallow, biased thinking that is so typical of those who will endure all manner of logical and intellectual contortions in order to pursue their blind hatred of Salmond and the SNP.Peter A Bellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14204261467942498747noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3323167987164959411.post-76901103150407808332012-10-27T18:05:02.886+01:002012-10-27T18:05:02.886+01:00Neither of us are going to covert the other to the...Neither of us are going to covert the other to the merits of his cause. Nevertheless, for the benefit of others, here's the verbatim transcript:<br /><br />AN: Have you sought advice from your own Scottish law officers on this matter?<br /><br />AS: We have, yes, in terms of the debate. <br /><br />AN: And what do they say?<br /><br />AS: Well you can read that in the documents that we’ve put forward which argue the position that we’d be successor states. <br /><br />AN: And what do they say?<br /><br />AS: Well you know I can’t give you the legal advice or reveal the legal advice of law officers, you know that Andrew, but what you can say is that everything that we publish is consistent with the legal advice that we receive. <br /><br />And the film: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p1pt-zOnU9c<br /><br />The charge against Salmond is that he lied, not that he breached the ministerial code. It is no defence to the charge of perjury that theft was not committed. <br /><br />Any intelligent person will know that it is possible for the DFM to make a statement on the referendum consultation without simultaneously revealing the fact that the legal advice had not previously been sought. It is preposterous for you to suggest that those two separate and distinct matters are in fact coterminous and it is a howling insult to the intellgence of your readers. Grahamnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3323167987164959411.post-4912852276840377992012-10-27T17:55:54.231+01:002012-10-27T17:55:54.231+01:00Apologies for the delay in publishing you comments...Apologies for the delay in publishing you comments. I really must remember to check the spam folder more frequently.Peter A Bellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14204261467942498747noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3323167987164959411.post-47115575050529019652012-10-27T17:30:55.769+01:002012-10-27T17:30:55.769+01:00There is, of course, another weapon: satire
http:...There is, of course, another weapon: satire<br /><br />http://www.bbc.scotlandshire.co.uk/index.php/city-news/60-labour-arse.htmlBBC Scotlandshirehttp://bbc.scotlandshire.co.uknoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3323167987164959411.post-72877957100118124642012-10-27T15:14:13.379+01:002012-10-27T15:14:13.379+01:00In the interview, the First Minister was clearly r...In the interview, the First Minister was clearly referring to already published statements from various parties relating to Scotland's post-independence status vis-à-vis the EU. He could not have been referring to anything else for the simple reason that nothing else existed.<br /><br />I say again, if Salmond had been referring to unpublished legal advice from the government's Law Officers then the confirmation that such advice existed would have constituted a breach of the ministerial code. To claim that he could have committed such a breach without Andrew Neil noticing at the time, and nobody else noticing for more than six months, is simply not credible.<br /><br />The Deputy First Minister's statement on the referendum consultation had been planned for some considerable time. So that's another inane conspiracy theory shot down in flames. Peter A Bellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14204261467942498747noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3323167987164959411.post-51858894844784697972012-10-27T13:44:25.733+01:002012-10-27T13:44:25.733+01:00I've viewed the interview several times and I&...I've viewed the interview several times and I'm satisfied with my understanding of what was said. The SNP has been repeatedly questioned, before and after the interview, on the matter of Scotland's EU membership status, not least because it is a legitimate matter of significant public interest, entirely relevant to Scotland's constitutional future. The DFM revealed on Tuesday that, contrary to what the FM had said and implied during the interview, no advice had previously been sought from law officers, it was now being sought and the legal action against the information commissioner was being abandoned. <br /><br />The media lapped it up, it became the big story and the resignations immediately dropped down and then off the agenda. However, had there been just one more resignation, the big story would have been that the SG lost it's parliamentary majority, the potential repercussions of which, particularly because self-inflicted, are interesting. <br /><br />Can I ask if you honestly believe that the timing of DFM's announcement and that of the resignations is a mere coincidence? Grahamnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3323167987164959411.post-35745719093473875162012-10-27T12:11:53.996+01:002012-10-27T12:11:53.996+01:00This comment has been removed by the author.Peter A Bellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14204261467942498747noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3323167987164959411.post-33483784205027054092012-10-27T12:01:32.749+01:002012-10-27T12:01:32.749+01:00This was very informative, thank you. Can you expl...This was very informative, thank you. Can you explain what the difference is between the nod the Scottish government got for their various publications, and the advice Nicola Sturgeon is now seeking?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3323167987164959411.post-81749175183085630402012-10-27T11:16:17.504+01:002012-10-27T11:16:17.504+01:00That interview was more than six months ago. Do yo...That interview was more than six months ago. Do you seriously believe that if Salmond had said what is claimed neither Andrew Neil nor any other British nationalist would have latched onto it in all that time?Peter A Bellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14204261467942498747noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3323167987164959411.post-83665264334669065222012-10-27T02:45:43.149+01:002012-10-27T02:45:43.149+01:00Peter, I accept that your interpretation of the Sa...Peter, I accept that your interpretation of the Salmond/Neil interview as depicted by you here and elsewhere is genuinely held. I also acknowledge the inherent and widespread Unionist media bias that you refer to. <br /><br />However, my interpretation differs. I take no pleasure from it but the First Minister intentionally misled during the interview - an uncharacteristic error of judgement. The resignations were seized as an opportunity to lance the boil. Most of the politically interested among us will be sufficiently inured to lies to understand that the worst offence is not the commission of the act itself, it's the getting caught. In this instance the obscurity of the topic, the sheer incompetence of the Opposition and the unfolding of the circumstances appear to have afforded the FM a decent recovery in the end. But it could have turned out different.Grahamnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3323167987164959411.post-62386211751690265292012-10-27T01:12:38.020+01:002012-10-27T01:12:38.020+01:00Brilliant again as per, Peter;-)))Brilliant again as per, Peter;-)))Graeme McAllanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12299053429125131921noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3323167987164959411.post-50073670539567861962012-10-26T19:39:37.364+01:002012-10-26T19:39:37.364+01:00This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.fitheachhttp://www.fitheach.co.uknoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3323167987164959411.post-12406218402655616262012-10-26T18:41:16.288+01:002012-10-26T18:41:16.288+01:00@Effie Deans
You haven't read this thread very...@Effie Deans<br />You haven't read this thread very carefully; if you had you would have noticed the post immediately before yours has a link to The Courier article which states:<br /><br />''Whilst there is a strong public interest in seeing what legal advice has been provided to the UK Government on the implications of EU membership if Scotland were to achieve independence, we have concluded that this is outweighed by a strong public interest in the Government being able to seek free and frank legal advice.''<br /><br />Innocence in this case is not obvious to everyone because the mainstream media is completely one sided. The facts speak loudly but not enough to be heard over the hysterical propaganda being peddled.<br /><br />PS<br />Peter, did my second contribution yesterday get caught in the spam trap again?fitheachhttp://www.fitheach.co.uknoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3323167987164959411.post-33875833121240067022012-10-26T16:24:07.874+01:002012-10-26T16:24:07.874+01:00Excellent article Peter. I think the last sentence...Excellent article Peter. I think the last sentence of 2.35 needs to be emphasised too. It explains what AS was talking about clearly.<br /><br />"Views given by the Law Officers in their Ministerial capacity are not subject to this restriction."Jutemanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11061671774494923407noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3323167987164959411.post-23631522735324552722012-10-26T15:24:49.637+01:002012-10-26T15:24:49.637+01:00You choose to disregard the fact that those making...You choose to disregard the fact that those making the false allegations have the unstinting support of almost the entire mainstream media in promulgating their lies. Not least, a certain Tom Peterkin - http://bit.ly/XpSuNGPeter A Bellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14204261467942498747noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3323167987164959411.post-64077600737724323522012-10-26T15:15:49.076+01:002012-10-26T15:15:49.076+01:00I think your putting up an extraordinary resourcef...I think your putting up an extraordinary resourceful defence of Mr Salmond. Indeed it is about as good a defence as could be made under the circumstances. Under circumstances, however, where innocence was obvious to everyone, there would be no need to make any defence. effiedeanshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00898070865193101575noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3323167987164959411.post-50416268566195618232012-10-26T13:34:46.773+01:002012-10-26T13:34:46.773+01:00The UK government has been asked. And they have re...The UK government has been asked. And they have refused to reveal anything on precisely the same grounds as cited by the First Minister. Double standards? Hypocrisy? British nationalism?<br /><br /><a href="http://www.thecourier.co.uk/News/Politics/article/19176/uk-government-accused-of-hypocrisy-for-refusing-to-release-legal-advice-on-independence-and-the-eu.html" rel="nofollow">The Courier - UK Government accused of 'hypocrisy' for refusing to release legal advice on independence and the EU</a>Peter A Bellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14204261467942498747noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3323167987164959411.post-311489015566058692012-10-26T13:25:20.331+01:002012-10-26T13:25:20.331+01:00My response to this unionist attack was - Is that ...My response to this unionist attack was - Is that really all they've got?. <br /><br />Has anyone asked Michael Moore (with an FOI) what legal advice he has received on the EU issue? Siônnynhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00021974709953206048noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3323167987164959411.post-77643127305024184862012-10-26T12:21:06.664+01:002012-10-26T12:21:06.664+01:00The sensationalist headline. The pejorative in ...The sensationalist headline. The pejorative in 'single quotes'. The response buried at the bottom of the page. They use every trick in the book, Martyn.<br /><br />But we too have our weapons. The advantage of online publishing is that we can take the time and space to dissect the lies and distortions. The benefit of social media is that we can get the truth out to lots of people, very quickly, and in a form that is easily accessible.Peter A Bellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14204261467942498747noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3323167987164959411.post-13301676148327906102012-10-26T12:16:22.609+01:002012-10-26T12:16:22.609+01:00I do like a bit of positive feedback. Many thanks!...I do like a bit of positive feedback. Many thanks!Peter A Bellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14204261467942498747noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3323167987164959411.post-44041027330016459632012-10-26T12:01:04.405+01:002012-10-26T12:01:04.405+01:00Peter,
It is clear to see why they are pushing t...Peter, <br /><br />It is clear to see why they are pushing this in the way they are, to the general public who either have no time or inclination to get into the nuts and bolts of this it makes AS and the SNP look bad.<br /><br />It is just like using sensationalist headlines in a newspaper (as we see all to often) to give the impression that there is no need to read the entire article.Martyn Jffreyhttps://www.facebook.com/martyn.jeffreynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3323167987164959411.post-47490367163032759052012-10-26T11:58:36.627+01:002012-10-26T11:58:36.627+01:00Brilliant piece, Peter...Brilliant piece, Peter...MekQuarriehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09818669820171475600noreply@blogger.com